Pluripod S01E02 - 'Pirate Lady'
Pluripod S01E02 Transcript
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Matt: [00:00:00] Welcome to Pluripod. This is a podcast all about the Apple TV show, pluribus, uh, from Vince Gilligan, and we're super excited to share the show with you. I'm joined by my cohost, Victoria Glin. I'm Matt Waterworth. We talk about every episode of the show, uh, this season, and we're super excited to share those conversations with you.
Just a heads up, we get right into spoilers. Uh, there's not really any, any break or warning beforehand. So this is it. Uh, make sure you're watching the episodes of the show before you're tuning into episodes of our show. And if you have any questions about our show or looking for a link of any kind, it's all gonna be on plural pod.com.
So thankful you'd join us. Let's jump right into it. Start, we sort of end with this. What were your overall impressions of this episode? And for me it's a bit, it's a bit difficult to separate the two, but, um, where does this episode start?
Victoria: It first cuts to, uh. A completely different woman.
Matt: Yes. We're in a completely different country.
Something
Victoria: completely different.
Matt: I forgot about that. Yes.
Victoria: Yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah. And we're like, what? You know, there's no carol. There's no nothing. So we're going back to the them [00:01:00] idea.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And or at least you think, or maybe you're like, maybe this is one of the immune people,
Matt: I forgot
Victoria: to say. Right. And yeah, she ends up like swapping with another gentleman and they're picking up, she's picking up bodies and putting them into a truck and then she hops onto a plane Yes.
And starts flying over. Right. And then we cut to Carroll.
Matt: Yeah. Right. And uh, there are a couple of interesting things about that. Um. We didn't mention it last episode, but, uh, ler the, the person who, the agriculture guy
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: Who was sort of stands in for the, for the president, who we think is the president.
Um,
Victoria: we talked to like an AI bot that doesn't have any personnel. Does definitely, but like just wants to support the group. Yeah.
Matt: Which is interesting because like. I guess they say like, oh, we picked him 'cause he was wearing a suit and he was the, you know,
Victoria: he'd make you most comfortable. Right, right. He thought that an authority figure.
And like as someone who studied agents of political violence, like doctors and nurses and politicians, like, because of their status, you're like, okay, like a person in a suit is more respectable. Right.
Matt: And when someone in a leadership position [00:02:00] has this, whatever this is, yeah,
Victoria: yeah. You turn the TV on for feeling good about.
The general structure of the 1% and the government supporting you. So you went I'm, yes. Great America.
Matt: Interesting. Yeah. I wanna know more about that, the psychology of that. But the, uh, the interesting thing that happened, TFL says, or, or this, this, the others say something to the effect of, you might wanna stay at home for the next couple of days, Carol, because we're gonna be cleaning up.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: There's a lot of death and destruct. And it would
Victoria: upset you.
Matt: Yeah. It would be upsetting. Yeah. Um. That's what we see at the beginning of this episode is people just cleaning up dead bodies. Right? Yep. That's, that's kind of the first thing,
Victoria: like cleanup crews. Yeah. That's at the beginning.
Matt: Yeah. And then presumably the others select, uh, Zha, who's the, the name of, of this other mm-hmm.
Uh, to be the person they want interacting with. Car and we find out why later. But it is a very fascinating sort of sequence of shots with no [00:03:00] dialogue, where we're just kind of seeing the others sort of like, like explore or, or, um, clean up the, I don't even know what country we're in. Um, but, uh, Zosia gets, gets in that airplane, like you said.
And what I wanted to mention is, and I, I recommend any, anybody, uh, listen to that episode of, uh, sad, happy, confused, because. That performer talks about how she had to actually learn to taxi that massive airplane. That like cargo.
Victoria: Yes. Yeah.
Matt: She did it. I mean, she didn't fly it, but she w she like taxied it.
She had to like control it.
Victoria: She didn't have a copilot or anything. Right. I was thinking that when I was watching it, so I'm like, she's by herself. But when it's a high of mind, like I. You don't need the other pers, but yeah, it's just Right.
Matt: She's got, she's presumably got like all the knowledge that anyone who would have about that specific plane.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: Meaning like maintenance history and all that stuff. But additionally, all the knowledge of every pilot in the world who knows how to, how to pilot [00:04:00] a, a, a plane. And this brings me to a good question for you as a performer.
Victoria: Mm.
Matt: There's something that, that I think a couple of actors have talked about.
Saying like, oh, I'm nervous to do this. And normally when, when you, when you're playing a character who's doing something new or difficult or something you've had to learn to, to, to do, to present on screen. You can use those nerves. Usually the scene makes sense for you to be nervous about, about what's going on.
So the character's nervous about what's going on. These performers don't get that right. They have to have perfect certainty, clarity, and comfort with what they're doing. And so, so what's your take on that as, as far as like the, you know, the actor's perspective on that?
Victoria: Oh, I mean. There would just be so much research.
There would be so much research and I'd have so many questions and I would be trying my best probably to be in like Air Force simulators.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: And just running the thing as many times. Yeah. Yeah. As I could. 'cause you saw she flick the switch, then the one engine came on, [00:05:00] then she flicked the like. She was very intentional with it.
Sure. Yeah. You have to be right. Like you have to, she has to know how to fly this plane. Yeah. So I, and I mean, she drives the moped and she has to kind of engineer the truck a little bit at the beginning. So I mean, I think that's part of the challenge and the fun as an actor, right, to
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Have to learn these things.
Yeah.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Like either in the medical field that you're getting into too, or into the legal field, like having to understand even like, I got my gun license because I couldn't. I couldn't be that person that doesn't know how to hold a gun if they're asking me to be a cop. Right? So it's just like. How fascinating that must be too.
How fun that is. Yeah, yeah. Like having to learn about the different types of planes that she's flying and that one specifically, and why they picked that one.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Would be interesting to see. Yeah. Yeah.
Matt: I wonder about, look. It always makes me wonder about like how much work Vince and the other writers have had to do, [00:06:00] like to research it.
Like we were talking last episode about like, well, what would the best way to deliver this kind of agent into a population be?
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Uh, what's the most efficient way? Because presumably that's what. This entity would, would do.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Um, yeah. Why is it that plane and, and uh, like even the, um, the, the way zosia like disrobe as she like, walks into the empty airport
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: And is like walking into this amazing, like, shower area and there's like, like, it's like she's got her own servants, but yeah, they're all the same entity working towards the same goal.
Victoria: They're trying to make her more comfortable, look better so that Carol is more comfortable when she meets her. Yeah.
Matt: It's, uh,
Victoria: and the like, so much of it in general, like the synchronicity of the timing of all these beats that are happening while it's going,
Matt: even though like handing off the helmet to like the other person who's gonna take the moped away,
Victoria: oped, all of that's the person dries up.
Exactly. There's not a moment of waiting.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: For anything. And the [00:07:00] women that are helping are getting changed, you know, like it's all.
Matt: It's like
Victoria: perfectly to,
Matt: yeah. It's big and choreographed. Yeah. At like that long shot where we saw the, the person with the leg, but also like, there was way more to that shot too, like that, like they had someone with a, with a, um, fire extinguisher and a bus was on fire and people coming out of it.
Victoria: Yes. I'm like, what's happened? Some people were lighting it on fire, some people were extinguishing it out. Like I was like, wait.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Like I can comprehend. Is that person with the leg? Like is he sentient? Is he, 'cause we don't see him in episode two.
Matt: Right? Right. Yeah.
Victoria: Yeah. At least we don't see someone jumping around with a mangled leg.
Matt: It's, it's an interesting like reflection of the idea of, wow, what if we were all able to just be so perfectly. Cooperative, right? Mm-hmm. Like, like that vehicle arrives right at the perfect time for this handoff to happen. Like it's, it's very interesting and like there's a part of me that's like, oh, I wish society could function this way.
Well, it's could be dis efficient.
Victoria: It's so fascinating 'cause Marlo and I went to Japan earlier this [00:08:00] year and like. You kind of see a little bit of this too here in that like in, out in Asia, like they are so focused on respect and the collective and the community,
Matt: right?
Victoria: They are not focusing on the ego of the individual.
They're focusing on the group common good. Yeah. And how you can do well for the common good and for your neighbor.
Matt: Interesting.
Victoria: And how more like out west, out here? Just America in general is more eye focused, more me focused, so you know, and pros and cons to all of it. So I just thought like that was.
Interesting and fascinating too, because in some aspects I'm like, yeah, the culture and the respect over there is incredible. There's no letter to be found anywhere. And there's garbages nowhere to be found than where you're eating. That's
Matt: right. Yeah.
Victoria: So it's just, and it's so clean, so it's. It's very interesting.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Just throw out all of this.
Matt: Yeah, that's a good comparison, right? Because it does seem like Japan has like a really [00:09:00] amazing, efficient Yeah. Like, like system, but
Victoria: aren't they 50 years ahead of us
Matt: in some ways? Yeah.
Victoria: Yeah. You know,
Matt: for sure.
Victoria: Yeah. So it's
Matt: interesting.
Victoria: Mm-hmm. Okay.
Matt: So, uh, so what happens, Socha arrives in the US in Al in Albuquerque, presumably.
Victoria: Yeah. So she, Carol. You know, they say in episode one, let us help you. If there's anything that you need, just call us. Hit zero twenty four seven. We'll help. Mm-hmm. And Carol is set on putting Helen, burying her by herself, right? Yes. Right.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And so, but where she is, the rock is extremely difficult to carve through.
So. Uh, yeah. We meet Zha Cleaned, ready and approaching as a neighbor that wants to help and explaining that, you know, she saw her from the drone 40,000 feet up. Yeah.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And,
Matt: and this is, this is the first indication for me that there's like, sort of like a childlike, uh, [00:10:00] naivete to the others.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: In that like, if wouldn't, wouldn't they know that Carol would hate.
To know that she's being spied on by a drone like that, like we would all feel, everyone would feel violated by that. A well,
Victoria: she says that, but she says like, but it's unarmed.
Matt: Right, right. And it's, it's totally unarmed. Yeah.
Victoria: Yeah. It can't hurt you,
Matt: you know, like there is something confusing about that and I wonder
Victoria: And sinister
Matt: Yeah, for sure.
Because like if, if the entity has everyone's consciousness, surely it has the consciousness of. Stephen King or, or, but like, like some writers who like, know about dread and suspense Yes. Like things that, that, that make us upset as Yes. And yet it seems to be ignoring some of those obvious things. And, and there are a couple other moments that I'll, I'll bring up too, but like, this was the first time where it's like, well, yeah, duh, nobody would want to be spied on by a drone.
Uh,
Victoria: but then she apologizes.
Matt: Of course. Yeah. It's,
Victoria: and offers a solution. Right. A difficult tool to use, but [00:11:00] your neighbor over there has a pickax.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: You know, and then she even does end up using the pickax and giving up and using it. But then she also offers her again, like, you've been doing this for two hours, Carol, we can tell that your temperature's elevated and that you're stressed.
And you know,
Matt: it's the opinion of every doctor on earth.
Victoria: Yes. You're about to, we're probably gonna have a heat stroke. Yeah. Yeah. So, and she offers her a bottle of water.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: And then she just dumps it out in front of her. Yeah. And how she's trying to explain that was really cool too. Right? Like, well, what's in the water?
She's like, well, it's unopened, sort of thing. And she's explaining that to her best of her knowledge from the hive mind. Yeah. She knows when the bottle was planted.
Matt: Person who was there when, when that bottle was filled.
Victoria: Yeah. We can assure you. Nothing, nothing happened. You haven't been roof feed or anything, Carol like
Matt: Yeah.
And like we're starting to see some of the, the upsides of having a friend who happens to have awareness of every act in, in, you know, human conscious history.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: And, uh, we meet, uh, a character who makes good use of it later, but, uh. [00:12:00] There is this revelation that happens that like, oh, you look a lot like the character that I created.
Victoria: Yeah. She holds the book up.
Matt: Yeah, she brings the
Victoria: book up, the gentleman pirate,
Matt: which is kind of weird. A weird choice I thought. But anyway, it makes sense visually that, uh, but, but yeah, oftentimes like. The, the cover of a book is not necessarily what the, what the author had in mind. But
Victoria: you mean Fabio isn't your romantic dream?
Matt: Yeah, he's on cover. A lot of it
Victoria: just playing.
Matt: So, uh, so.
Victoria: Gender swapped. Fabio is not your romantic.
Matt: No, not for me.
Victoria: No.
Matt: But, but I can appreciate it. Uh, and the, um, the interesting thing is like, okay, we're, again, it's sort of a naive, sort of childlike decision to be like, oh, Carol likes the look of this person.
Let's, let's approach her as that person or as close as we can get.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Um,
Victoria: well, I mean, it's Darwin evolution of [00:13:00] species, right? Like, if I can recognize. Easier that you're my friend. Mm-hmm. Then I'm more likely to get along with you and you see later in the episode when that gentleman wants her, that she's upset.
Matt: You know
Victoria: what, she's kind of made a friend.
Matt: It's true. It's very true. You know, and even, even there's, there's a point where she's
Victoria: So they weren't wrong.
Matt: You're right. And she calls the number and says at one point that pirate lady can come back.
Victoria: Yes.
Matt: Yeah. Yeah.
Victoria: She's like,
Matt: yeah.
Victoria: Accepting that they've. Chosen rights.
Matt: Right. It's true. It's true.
Victoria: Right. She's like, you weren't, 'cause if they had chosen wrong, they could have brought like George Clooney.
Matt: Right, right. Oh, very, very good point. Oh man. Whoa, I didn't even think of that. What about this?
Victoria: Why not turning into George Clooney?
Matt: The potential for cameos in the show are huge,
Victoria: but that wouldn't have been the correct choice for Carol,
Matt: of course,
Victoria: because to make Carol happiest, we had to bring in this beautiful, exotic woman.
Right, right. You know, that was similar to her, her true.
Matt: Fantasy.
Victoria: Yeah,
Matt: yeah, yeah. It's interesting
Victoria: because Helen's [00:14:00] no longer here,
Matt: right? '
Victoria: cause the idea was that it was Helen
Matt: for sure.
Victoria: Right. But
Matt: so, uh, what happens next?
Victoria: Um, so the water part is really interesting. Uh, so yes, the. The one says that we have Helen's memories now.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: So we thought that this would be what you'd most enjoy.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: And she's wrapping her mind around that, about the fact that like the love of, I'm not sure if it's the love of her life, but like her partner that she really cares for
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Is now absorbed
Matt: mm-hmm.
Victoria: Into this being, and that's an invasion of privacy.
Right. Because she now knows everything. Um. Oh, yes. And then so she gets angry at Zha.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: And then she zha drops again.
Matt: Oh, right. This is,
Victoria: and then she starts trying to figure out what's going on and how to make it stop. And she figures it's just her. So then she goes into town, and then there's a gentleman like hanging from the ceiling.
Yes. Yes. That's, they're all [00:15:00] seizing, right?
Matt: Yeah. Yeah.
Victoria: And then they. Like she's caused a bug in the system.
Matt: Right. And this could be a huge tool.
Victoria: Yes.
Matt: If the show goes down this route of like, wow, Carol is going to have to fight against
Victoria: when she has an energetic outburst. Right, right. That is negative.
Matt: This could be a very positive tool for her in the future if she, if she just, you know, later on we see that Carol's trying to lead, uh, like a group of.
People who are not absorbed by the others into fighting back in some way, or, or, or like, I feel like this is gonna be a tool in her arsenal to, because it, it's actually a huge weakness on the part of, of the, this anti,
Victoria: they can't handle anything.
Matt: Can't handle being yelled at basic. Yeah. Yeah. So unfortunately it means millions of people seem to die, uh,
Victoria: but then they fix it.
Then they say, Hey, can we can help you? You know? 'cause she's dragging this body.
Matt: She's, she's trying to control the,
Victoria: the thing and she lets them.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Right.
Matt: Thank God. Yeah.
Victoria: Uh, and she [00:16:00] says to Zha, did I do that? And she said, yes. You did that?
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And then Zha offers to, she's like, I know you may not like it 'cause she, it's the like, I wanna do this myself.
I'll do it. 'cause Zha then takes, she apologizes and she takes the pickax and she starts doing it herself. And then she says, you know, we could do this faster.
Matt: Right. And,
Victoria: and she just airdrops.
Matt: Right. But that is structured. That is huge. A huge moment and a really well written moment I think too, because. The entire time.
Carol is not interested in any help. Support. Yeah. I'm not gonna give in to you. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not gonna be part of whatever this is. I'm, you know, don't, don't you dare touch my, my wife, my partner.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Uh. There's this brilliant shot of like, you know, we assume Helen is in this rolled up carpet and, and there's this brilliant shot of just like flies sort of circling around.
Victoria: Yep.
Matt: And that's where it's like, okay, well you, like I can, I can understand why Carol would decide I'm gonna give into accepting some help from these people, this person, uh, [00:17:00] given that. The body is decomposing as mm-hmm. As we speak. So I thought that was a really clever way of, of saying Carol's gonna give in, in this particular case, not in, not in all cases.
Mm-hmm. But she doesn't want Helen's body to be, you know, consumed by flies. That's awful. Yeah. And so, so, okay. Yes. I will give in and I will, I will, we'll use some, some of your special abilities to bring in whatever, you know, excavating tool we, we might want. To make this job a little a little faster.
Victoria: It's also interesting on the symbolism side of things too, because like the dead body and like the, like in my brain, I thought the flies were kind of symbolizing.
Them.
Matt: Oh yeah.
Victoria: Like they're here and they're helping the ecosystem new belong. This is just a natural process of life. Right.
Matt: For sure. And you've been using the word hive a lot, right? Which is totally fair. Um, there is sort of an ins. Sect, right. Sort of connection there. Mm-hmm. I think that's interesting. I wonder if we'll explain,
Victoria: you know, like when you see like bugs, uh, [00:18:00] their perspective, right?
Like you often see like those hexagon views, multi's, different multi realities.
Matt: That's a good
Victoria: point. But I feel like that's when, 'cause she says like, are there others like me and Zosia does confirm that there are mm-hmm. But you see her kind of doing that where she's kind of going out and I'm imagining that she's kind of going through those different.
Little hexagon. Yeah. Minds to try to see. And then, but that's interesting too, because she says, well, yes, there are others, but like, I need to ask their permission to meet you. They need it. You know, like, I need their consent before I can just have you meet them. But then they agree. And that's interesting too, because she says, well, of the 13, like how many, 12, how many of them can speak English?
Right? And she says, well, you know. This is the distrust still. 'cause uh, only six of them can. And she says, but I can translate for you. 'cause I know all of them and she refuses.
Matt: I would, I would feel exactly the same way. No, you're not being, you're not gonna be a part of these [00:19:00] conversations in any way.
Victoria: I need some privacy somewhere.
Okay. For
Matt: sure. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So, uh, yeah.
Victoria: And then she says too, like, we can introduce you to them, we can do this. Mm-hmm. But she also makes a warning that she can't protect, Zosia can't protect. Carol from the other ones that are immune.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: And isn't that weird? Like if they interfere or they attack her, she can't do anything.
Matt: Yeah, that is a good point. And, and we haven't really seen that in action yet, but there's a lot of talk about it in this episode for sure.
Victoria: It's like a weird foreshadow to like, but, but if there are only 11 people that exist left, why would we be attacking each other?
Matt: Right. Right. Well, we find out,
Victoria: right?
Matt: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and even later, Kumba talks about how like he wants to eat animals. And, and,
Victoria: yeah.
Matt: And so she was like, well, we're not gonna, we're not gonna kill animals.
Victoria: We don't harm any
Matt: Yeah. And, and the food you're having now is the freshest we could find.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: But it's like every piece of, you know, meat for, for food is currently going bad [00:20:00] and there's not gonna be any more unless Cuba says, well, what if I killed the animal?
They're like, yeah, okay. Which is kind of a weird ex exception, but anyway, I'm getting ahead of myself.
Victoria: No, it's true.
Matt: There's another good moment where Zosia. Sort of like, like checks out for a second where while presumably there's conversations happening in other parts of the world to say, Hey, Carol wants to meet you.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Uh, I didn't, I kind of didn't love this. This felt weird to me. I dunno what you think of this, but Bezo sort of like, like kind of like freezing while these conversations presumably happen elsewhere was kind of weird. Like it didn't. Like, it's clear that obviously this, this, um, entity can perform the many, many acts, presumably billions of, of actions and conversations, although not conversations necessarily, but, but actions without one.
Freezing necessarily. This, this seemed like weird as far as like, I'm, I'm a stickler for the rules. If, [00:21:00] if you've got anything science fiction or paranormal or, or horror, if you're gonna give me rules about, you know, the zombies can only run this fast, or, or you know, the, you know, this, this evil being can only, you know, become invisible at these times.
I want you to stick to those rules. Mm-hmm. If, if you're gonna set those rules, either stick to them or break them intelligently. And I, I found this moment a little bit odd because I don't understand why Zosia would need to like freeze.
Victoria: I feel like she's freezing. I don't think Zia's freezing because of the hive Mind us.
I think she's freezing because she's waiting for the response from the other humans to decide. Sure. Yeah.
Matt: But it was, it was sort of like, like Carol kind of like had to be like, hello, I'm, I'm here. Sort of like,
Victoria: yeah. You think she, and then she responds like, I am here.
Matt: She does. Yeah, you're right. Yeah. Yeah.
Anyway, maybe it's, maybe it's nothing. Maybe, maybe I'm overreacting, but, um,
Victoria: it's an interesting perspective. Yeah, sure. Like why is this I, you know. Is that intentional? Is it not intentional? Does it mean something?
Matt: Yeah,
Victoria: that's, there's so much this whole [00:22:00] show.
Matt: Yeah,
Victoria: yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's a fair point. Like why, if she is, if it is all powerful and all this and all that, does it mm-hmm.
Would it glitch? Why would it need to? Yeah,
Matt: yeah, yeah.
Victoria: Um, so,
Matt: so, uh,
Victoria: and then she goes on the plane gets yes. They say yes. She goes on the plane. And that's funny too, because I love the comment where she's like. The TGI Friday Wait trip? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Flying the plane right now. And she's like, yeah, well there's no reason to worry about it.
'cause you know. Uh, and
Matt: we don't have TGI Fridays here in Canada as far as I know. No. Or at least not in, in Alberta.
Victoria: Not, yeah.
Matt: Uh, and so we didn't, like, we wouldn't necessarily know that uniform super well, but I wish, I wish we had TGI Fridays.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: But it sounds delete.
Victoria: He's daring bringing it to Canada.
Matt: Yes, please.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: So, uh, so yeah, that is, that is funny. Um, and then, uh, they arrive at, uh, I forget what the airport is.
Victoria: Yeah. They arrive at the airport. Yeah. And then you've got a group of people. Uh, the Immunes and then [00:23:00] you also have the members of the immune member's family.
Matt: The Immunes. I like it. Yeah.
Victoria: Right. Like those that are okay. But then you also have like in their, the husbands, the wife, the mother, the daughter, like the, the family members that weren't immune
Matt: mm-hmm.
Victoria: That are there with them. And it seems like every single one of them, other than one immune that hasn't arrived yet are. Happy.
Matt: Right?
Victoria: Like Carol is distraught. Yeah. Carol's upset. She's like, we need to pull them away. We need to like start speaking up. We need to have this conversation. And they're all like, this is my husband.
Matt: Right?
Victoria: Like, like this is my, I don't understand. He's not angry anymore. And
Matt: I'm, it feels a little weird, not angry at me.
Victoria: They're not upset anymore. There you go. My 9-year-old no longer has tantrums, no longer has any problems, goes to bed When I tell them to like.
Matt: Yeah. Again, this is a bit of a confusing moment for me, like, like something that happens [00:24:00] in. In, I don't know, any show where you're sort of exploring an idea that would maybe be solved if people just sat down and and spoke with each other.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: And they do later and, and, and, uh, I, I, I, that they handle it well, but, but in this moment it's, it, it's like, how, how can we not all be in agreement that this is really weird? Um.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: And, and yeah. I mean, I, there are parts of me that are like, wouldn't Carol just say. Like, do you not understand that, that they're gone?
Like, and she does actually say some of that a Yeah, a little bit. Yeah.
Victoria: Well, it kind of comes back to like the criminology thing, if I may.
Matt: Yeah. Yes. And And you didn't mention that last, the last time you have a, A background.
Victoria: Yeah. Yeah. So I went to Carleton University for criminology and psychology with law.
Matt: Cool.
Victoria: And like we learned like agents of perpetrators of violence and like just these studies of like how could these humans commit atrocious acts and like go to bed at night and be okay with it.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: And it was [00:25:00] because a lot of it had to do with authority and like someone else. Told me to do this.
Ooh, someone else gave me the permission. So it's not my fault. This doctor authority figure told me that this person would be safe. So it's not on I pressed the button, but it was his instruction.
Matt: You're talking about Milgram experiments,
Victoria: right?
Matt: Yeah. You've sort of fascinated with,
Victoria: so I mean, I feel like that's kind of what seems to be happening.
Even stuff that happens like here, a lot of people like how, while there's also like the bystander effect, which is like the more people that you have to help you, the less likely you are to receive help. Because someone else is like, well, someone else will do it. I don't have to do it. So
Matt: yeah. Interesting.
Victoria: Personally, like. I've gotten myself into trouble. 'cause I'm like, that's not gonna happen. So it has to be me. And then I'm running into problems and it's like, well, that's not, but, um,
Matt: I feel the same way. That's interesting that you should say that because like, I, I, I, I feel like wow, people are, don't take action, so I'm gonna have to be the one to take action.
Victoria: Well, so she kind of feel like we're more like Carol because we're [00:26:00] like, how could, how could you not be losing your mind? Please
Matt: don, please don't stand by. This happened. Yeah. Yeah.
Victoria: But that's kind of, we've seen that over the last. Few years too, and like people were reciting about how, well, what happens, agents of political violence, how do we commit atrocities to someone else?
Well, first we start saying that there is a massive problem that is causing a breakdown in society of structure. That could be economic, that could be uh, like it could be medical, what have you.
Matt: Could
Victoria: be woke him as. Could be woke. Yeah.
Matt: Uh, yeah.
Victoria: Um, and then we start slowly. Over time, 439 days, 70 days, 50 days.
We start telling people, you know that there's a problem here. We need to solve it, we need to fix it. And they have our best interest at heart. And you know, that's what matters. And then we start slowly like taking things away from people that don't follow the status quo
Matt: it. We've seen it in history over and over.
Right.
Victoria: Like
Matt: moving
Victoria: with [00:27:00]
Matt: Yeah,
Victoria: yeah, yeah. Well that's the thing is there's. During the pandemic, like here, there were a lot of, you know, violations of Charters of Rights for the Canadians and like just a lot of people in general that were losing, like seeing a piece of the newspaper that was like, at least I was in Ontario at the time, that was like.
If you don't take the vaccine, then you don't deserve a hospital bed. It's like, well, did you smoke a cigarette or have a hamburger around McDonald's in the lab ever Like that,
Matt: for sure.
Victoria: We need equality for every
Matt: Well, yeah. Everyone deserves to be taken care of,
Victoria: you know, so it's, it's just, it's interesting idea that we're running into with these people that like, how could you just be so agreeable so quickly?
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And how could you just be okay with that? And they're like. But my loved ones aren't suffering.
Matt: Well, and that's, and that is what is interesting about Carol is she's choosing not to indulge in any of these amazing outcomes that,
Victoria: but Carol also doesn't have any loved ones that's still attached to her anymore.
Matt: That's point, although. Neither does K Kumba, right? Like
Victoria: yeah. As far as we know, that's the different [00:28:00] idea.
Matt: But he does, but he got with him.
Victoria: So Kumba is so interesting because Kumba is like the type that's gonna take advantage of this happening for like, like he feels like he won the Willy Wonka's chocolate.
Sure.
Matt: He's, you know, Vince talks about, uh, I, I forget where he was talking about the show, but like, yeah. How this idea got very, he used the term porny, right? Like when, when you can have sort of control over the, uh, over whatever you,
Victoria: well, like a Machiavellian.
Matt: Yeah, for sure. Yeah.
Victoria: And I mean, it's
Matt: interest, big and
Victoria: interest step.
They chose a gentleman from like India. Mm-hmm. Right? Because I mean, that's the, like the traditional marriage and the stuff like that. Like they don't, you know, so the fact that it's. More accepted there. And then he comes here and now he's just like, well, it's the whole world. The whole world is my way around.
Matt: He's got his harem of women, he's got Air Force one. He's, he's very much yeah. Indulging in, in the offerings that the others have for him, which is, I mean, amazing. Like what? [00:29:00]
Victoria: Like his,
Matt: like a part of me is like, I get that too. Like I would, uh, I would want any meal. I could, I could imagine and, yeah.
Victoria: Yeah. Like if it's your, you know, similar to the idea of your last supper in jail, like if you know that the end is coming.
Because he thinks through it. That's
Matt: not how he sees it though,
Victoria: Paul. He, he, no, like, he's just like, well, you know, I can have exactly everything that I want and I might as well. And like if, yeah, like he's the indulgent of like, he's bringing up old recipes that he couldn't make by himself anymore and his aunt couldn't have like, yeah.
His aunt that passed away he could make again, right? Like how wonderful that was. Yeah. The fact that they could just bring that up. So you're seeing points of like. But wouldn't you want that?
Matt: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Victoria: Like if I could have my grandmother's recipe and she's not here anymore, if I could have it exactly how she make it, wouldn't I want that again?
Matt: Right. For sure.
Victoria: Right. Yeah. And like the harem of woman is interesting and that's funny 'cause she's like. You know, he approaches her zha and he is like, but I've been chatting with Zha and I see [00:30:00] how upset she is. Right? Yeah. I'm learning more about her. And you didn't even bother to meet her name.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: You know, and then she's has her evaluate the square root. Right. And so she can evaluate the square root of Oh yeah. Yeah. Being able to do that. And she's like, well, you have to make the decision about whether or not you would be, I need your permission to leave. You and go with him. And she's like, well, make up your own mind.
'cause if you can figure out this answer, then you can have your own result. And she says, but, but either way, I, my choice would be upsetting you and I can't upset
Matt: you. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Victoria: So that's,
Matt: this is another area that I want to, I wanna know a lot more about when it comes to the others is because like, there's, yeah, it has this code right about, about kill, not killing animals and, and like, not upsetting Carol.
Mm-hmm. If, if possible. But then it's also done so many horrible things, not that it perceives them that way. Um, yeah,
Victoria: like when, when Carol asks, when they get on the [00:31:00] airplane and she gets what she wants because, uh, that gentleman comes in with the plane and then she says all of them. Get outta here.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: Leave.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And then she also turns the communications off and she's like, of course. Right. And she doesn't, you know, like that's, so,
Matt: but there's, there's, in the back of my mind, I don't know about you, but in the back of my mind, there's, there's, I'm, I'm concerned that it's actually all ready, like, miked to the room.
She
Victoria: doesn't have in the air, like, or whatever it might be, you know?
Matt: Yeah. I don't know. Like, I, I, there's a part of me that. I think basically this can go one of two ways. It's like this, this thing is evil. But it's these ni it's these naive childlike moments that make me think, okay. No, and there's another one at, at the dinner table after they, after they get off Air Force One.
Um, you were talking about, um, uh, LA Lakshmi, uh, and mm-hmm. Her LaMi and her son,
Victoria: and how her grandfather passed away when she was upset,
Matt: right? Yeah,
Victoria: right. [00:32:00] Yeah,
Matt: that's right.
Victoria: And she's like, well, it's
a
Matt: big one,
Victoria: right? So she's like. Because Carol didn't know initially how many people had died in the first place from when they first arrived.
Yeah. And then she told her because she was pushing her on it.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And then she kind of had like her power back again. And then LAX me was like, you killed 11 million people with your outburst.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Like. Mm. And one of them was your grandfather,
Matt: right?
Victoria: Like her grandfather
Matt: was her grandfather already gone.
Right.
Victoria: We have no idea.
Matt: Right? Yeah.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: Well, I mean, I'm, by that I mean, like, was, was her grandfather already gone by virtue of being part of the others? Mm. Or. Is
Victoria: she lying or is she Yeah.
Matt: That, that could be too. But, but I mean, like she's, she's obviously okay with her family members being part of the others.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: But, but that, that moment where, where, uh, Carol asks like, you know, if you're doing a, a gynecological exam
Victoria: Oh my goodness. Yeah. Where she asks, she, she, she's accepted. Yeah. Yeah. Until she asked a [00:33:00] 9-year-old a question that a, that should never know.
Matt: Such a great way
Victoria: to, and men lax me's upset.
Matt: Yeah, exactly.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: And. But that, but to me, like that's an obvi, that's a pretty obvious play on Carol's part to make the others look bad and make, and, and make the people who are not, you know, part of the entity, uh, what do you call them? The immune.
Victoria: Yeah,
Matt: that's, that's probably a good name for it, because that's exactly what it is.
They must have some kind of immunity, which happens right, with, with any, any kind of disease randomly. Some people are immune for whatever reason, genetically, but. Yeah. Like showing her that this, that, that her son is not her son anymore, was not something she wanted to see, and, and just made the others look bad again.
It's like, it, it's such a, like a, like an objective and like, like innocent thing to do.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Which makes me think that the, the, this entity is not evil. Anyway, I'm, I'm gonna struggle with this all season. I'm sure
Victoria: you and I both, because I mean, a lot of the struggle is. [00:34:00] Like it's almost Machiavellian in itself and that it's like, it gives you this child, like, I'm so sorry.
We didn't mean to do that, but like, then why? But you still did it. Yeah. Yeah. But you're still,
Matt: and why are you okay with the, how many people died? Like, like do, do you remember that number? Like during the first transition? I wanted to say, they said it was like a billion.
Victoria: It was like hundreds of millions
Matt: of people.
Hundreds of million.
Victoria: Yeah. It was, I think it was like 836 million or something. Yeah. Like it was an absurd,
Matt: yeah. Yeah. Why is it okay with that, but not okay with like, say, killing a a cow for, for Kube?
Victoria: Yeah. Well, she says like. Yeah. You, you're not okay with killing the animal, but we just killed, but it's, it's kind of the idea of like, but we only did it once.
Matt: Right, right. Yeah. Well, and you talked and they did talk about how it had to happen faster.
Victoria: It had to happen fast. That
was,
Matt: it's not a good enough [00:35:00] reason for me though.
Victoria: Why was it faster?
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Why did it need to be
Matt: faster? Right. And sure, I get it. I get, okay. The military discovered you, but it doesn't mean that you couldn't just contain that issue.
Right. Like, why did the entire world have to be so quickly converted? And obviously at the expense
Victoria: and we never saw how the military contained it.
Matt: It's gonna be confusing. Like, I don't know, like, honestly, I don't know how Vince is going to do that. Like, he's gotta like, it's, it's gonna be a tough. If it's not like this reveal that like, yeah, we're just evil and we're just taking over the, over the planet and we're prepping the earth for the aliens to arrive and take all the resources or whatever, whatever it might be.
I, I don't know how, yeah, I don't know how Vince is gonna make that work without it being evil. I'm very curious about more episodes.
Victoria: I'm, yeah, I'm fascinated, uh, like how they're at their dinner table and they explain that there's like zha iss explaining how there's no racism. There's no theft. Mm-hmm.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: All dogs are off of chains. There's peace. And then that one woman comments about how she didn't wanna lose her dog. [00:36:00] And that was the most upsetting part,
Matt: right? Yeah.
Victoria: Not that her family had like changed or anything, but like that her dog was free.
Matt: It is a little frustrating.
Victoria: Where did the dogs go?
Matt: Yeah, where did the dogs go and where did the,
Victoria: is there a hive Mine with dogs
Matt: and the zoos are like, are all the, the animals just roaming free?
Victoria: No, because, well, that's what she was saying. Yeah. She was upset about the fact that she lived near the zoo.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: Now the animals are free,
Matt: so is that all the animals are just, and is that a good thing?
Or like, like, like
Victoria: are having a Noah's Ark moment, like, are all the animals like coming together?
Matt: I just listen to this amazing podcast. Um, I think it's on serial, uh, about, uh, the, the whale that played Willie in Free Willie.
Victoria: Okay.
Matt: That incredible, that journey is like insane. You can't just release, uh, an animal back like that and back into the water.
No. 'cause it doesn't have the
Victoria: skills. It can't survive.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: Um, and so. Uh, are the animals part of the others yet? Like, like is that how that's working? We don't know. Like, 'cause the rat was right.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: So we know animals. Could be or are they just, I don't know. So many questions. Yeah, so, so many more things we need to [00:37:00] know.
Victoria: And even like, that brought a good point too. My brain just jumped to, like humans in general. Like, well, if we just, if we saved this whale and brought it in and took care of it and put it in captivity and now we had to perform for us, we can't. It's the greater good again. We can't let it out. It's gonna die.
Well, it's kind of how they're feeling with Carol. Like, we can't
Matt: Right,
Victoria: right. You know, we're just, we're just taking care of,
Matt: we've gotta,
Victoria: we've gotta
Matt: conceive
Victoria: you, we've gotta help you. Yeah.
Matt: Yeah. Um,
Victoria: wouldn't you be happy, Carol? You're miserable.
Matt: Yeah. So then the show takes a bit of a turn for me because.
Carol kind of storms off, causes another one of the, the freezing moments, right?
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: Which is
Victoria: she, my understanding is she has a drink at the dinner table. She trips, she slips,
Matt: right? Yeah.
Victoria: And then Zha goes to help her
Matt: and she's like, get off me.
Victoria: Did she, did Zha fall on her or something? Like she seemed upset and then she tripped on her and then she was trying to push her off and her pushing her off caused the big episode.
Yeah.
Matt: And [00:38:00] like Lakshmi's son is like seizing
Victoria: everyone.
Matt: It's it's off
Victoria: everyone's others.
Matt: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So. So then Carol, like, like, like is is a pariah because of this, right? Like, it's a, it's of course a horrible moment for everyone and probably she killed another, I, I shouldn't put it this way. She's, she's not the one doing this.
Um, but anyway, a probably a lot more people died.
Victoria: But that's what they want you to think is that her outbursts are causing
Matt: her fault.
Victoria: Right? Yeah. It's your fault.
Matt: Yeah. What if, what if you don't take over the human race? Maybe that's the way.
Victoria: It's interesting 'cause they have no accountability or very little accountability about saying how many people that they hurt in order to make this happen.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: But now Carol's hurting them and isn't that terrible?
Matt: Yeah, well for sure. But like, uh, the woman playing osha, um, I'm forgetting her name, she's incredible. Mm-hmm. Um, does such a good job of like sort of. Tiptoeing around that and being like, oh, you know, a few people died, but it's no big deal.
Victoria: Well, that's, yeah.
'cause she said, well, how many people did I hurt this time? Yeah. And she's like, [00:39:00] she's trying to bring her a drink of something that would've comforted her. 'cause she's like, well, I know that you really like that bottle and I'm just bringing it over. You know that you enjoyed like, I don't know how many years ago and she's, yeah.
Trying to comfort her.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: So it's just, I mean, but even on the psychology side of things, like when you're trying to, what's that book? Win Friends and Influence People.
Oh
Matt: yeah, yeah, yeah.
Victoria: Like you wanna give them all their needs. Sure. You wanna make sure that all their needs are met. 'cause she does wanna win Carol over.
Matt: Right. Which again, makes me nervous. Like why? Why are we trying to influence Carol?
Victoria: Carol's starting to move over
for,
Matt: for some things.
Victoria: For sure.
Matt: Yeah. In some ways. Yeah. Absolutely. Okay. So here's the big change that happens for me. Because I'm very interested and curious about like, how do the logistics of this all work?
Mm-hmm. And what, what cool doors could we open up? Air Force One is a great example of like, like, and, and I love the Kube character because we're getting to see more of that through, through him, but then it [00:40:00] shifts and you already talked a little bit about it, about how Scha is like, oh, I'm gonna go hang out with Kumba.
Victoria: Yeah. 'cause Carol's been out. Whatever her outburst was, it caused her to be out for a little bit. Yeah. And then Mbba spent, all the other immune people are upset with her and they're gone.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: And the only person that stayed is Kumba. Mm-hmm. Which is interesting 'cause now you're learning a little bit more about, is Kuumba only doing that because he wants osha?
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: Mm-hmm. Or is he doing that because he. Actually might agree in some aspect to Carol.
Matt: Yeah. And so, so there's this great but really long scene, um, and not in a, not long, in a bad way, but it's kinda the final dialogue scene of, of the episode where they're all kind of discussing, uh, like. To me, they're sort of discussing love, right?
Like they're discussing, like,
Victoria: yeah. 'cause she asked osha, did I ask you to do anything you didn't wanna do?
Matt: [00:41:00] Right? Yeah.
Victoria: Have I made you uncomfortable? And OSHA's refuses. She's like, no,
Matt: right.
Victoria: I, I want to make you this way. I want to make you happy.
Matt: But, but Kumba is maybe falling in love with Scha. Even though Zha is part of a hive mind, so, so that's confusing.
Um, but I'm, but obviously she decides she's gonna go with him. Carol decides it's okay with her, or doesn't give a shit about it
Victoria: until the very up where she decides it does
Matt: matter, matter, matter. And there's an amazing shot of her like stopping airplane
Victoria: on the front of the plane. Yeah.
Matt: Yeah. So
Victoria: how cool.
That would've been a fan there
Matt: and a part of, uh, no doubt. Yeah. Uh, a part of that makes me, oh. Not, maybe worried is the wrong thing, but like I'm very curious about where the show's gonna go and I'm wondering if it's gonna take us into this like, relationships conversation as opposed to some of the stuff that interests me a little bit more, which is like, how like is, is Carol.
Going to fight for [00:42:00] humanity? Uh, I don't think, I don't think that's gonna be the show. I don't think the show is gonna be Carol, like learning to defeat the others. Um, and, and like rescue people. Like that's something I'm curious about. Can anyone be removed from the others? Like is Yeah. Is that
Victoria: a, can you get it out?
Is that,
Matt: can you get a
Victoria: DNA
Matt: sequence? Is there a cure? Yeah. Yeah,
Victoria: yeah.
Matt: Um, but I kind of wonder if that's just not a route it's gonna take, like, because. That, like I said before, this idea having happened before, although Brick and Morty kind of did it too, uh, this idea that like, no, this isn't an alien invasion.
It's just a, it's just a benevolent force.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: And you can join it or not. Mm-hmm. And we're not gonna, we're not gonna give you a show about we like. Some kind of like fighting against the, the, the others. We're gonna give you a show about love and relationships in this, in this context, which is fascinating too.
I'm su I'm super interested in that, but there's a part of me that wants like action and like
Victoria: yeah, like
Matt: alien battles. Like I want [00:43:00] aliens to show up and be like, yeah, we were prepping the planet for, so I, it's, it could go anywhere at this point. It's very, it's very interesting.
Victoria: Yeah, it's true. I have no idea where it's gonna go either because, I mean, she just turned around and decided that she did want Soha, right.
So, yeah. You're entering into the element of like, okay, here's a relationship that she does care about Yeah. That she's starting to care about.
Matt: Although, is that, is that what's happening there? Because to be honest with you, it's, it's the female perspective on that has changed my opinion about it. Hmm.
Women who've seen it have ha have told me. They, they read that as like, no, Carol doesn't wanna lose OSHA in that moment.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: For me. It was more like Carol doesn't wanna lose any ounce of humanity that she can actually still connect with.
Victoria: Hmm.
Matt: That was my first viewing of it, is it's more like, okay, everyone, every immune person has left.
I actually wanna hang out with Kumba and be with the only other human being who's, who's, ah, an individual.
Victoria: Okay.
Matt: I think I'm wrong about that. Read of it [00:44:00] overall. Because, because you're not the only one who's been like, no, this is sort of a love story happening between the two of them. Maybe, maybe the beginning of it, not, not, not saying you're saying that, but it's definitely about the relationship between Zha and, and and Carol and like, are you taking that away from me?
I don't know. I'm so curious to like, to know what the even the first 10 minutes of the next episode are gonna be, because I think it'll tell us more about where they're going.
Victoria: Well, it's true. 'cause it's like, is Carol like. Like, is it the familiarity that she doesn't wanna lose Zosia for? Right. Or is it the fact that like this is, you're right.
Like this gentleman was actually like, even if they didn't agree, he had a real conversation with her. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And no one else was willing to do that.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: Whether they didn't have the capacity or they just didn't care.
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: So it was like. I mean, if you're on the whole planet and there's six people and five of them don't like you whatsoever, and there's only one that even you don't agree with at all.
Matt: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Victoria: Yeah, there could be some [00:45:00] companionship there too, like, or can they, and she asked like the group at the table, like, does anybody know science? Does anybody, right?
Matt: Yes. Yeah. We kind of skipped over
Victoria: that team. Anything at all. And they all said no.
Matt: Yeah. She even says like, we've seen this movie, I've seen this movie before.
We know what's happening.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: And I think that's maybe. Code and Vince wrote that episode as well, like, is that Vince telegraphing to us that it's like, it's, it's this, it's not that movie. Yeah. This is something else entirely. And so I think this episode was all I'm going. It's possible that this episode is all I'm gonna get in the vein of like, I want Carol to fight against this, and the show might believe me behind on that and be like, no, this is gonna be a show about, yeah.
A few people who are individuals and how they interact with, and what, what does love mean in that, in that, you know, in incarnation of it with, with a being that ex exists and knows all of, you, know, all of human consciousness. I, I, I want, I'm very curious because I think this will be a big turning point to, to know [00:46:00] where the show's going for, for the rest of season.
Mm-hmm. Um,
Victoria: well, it says even like what's been lost. When they turn, like that discussion between most of them that said, like, uh, when they turn us to them, that's what I want. I won't be unique. I'll be sharing my
Matt: experience. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I forgot about
Victoria: that. And that's an interesting, like, but then everyone would actually understand how I really feel.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: Mm-hmm. You know? Um. And that was interesting too, that every single person on that plane that was immune asked the others what it was like to join the others. And Carol didn't.
Matt: And they tagged Carol for that.
Victoria: Carol was the only one.
Matt: Yeah. Yeah.
Victoria: That didn't do that. But
Matt: don't like, how do you feel about it?
Like, like if you were in Carol's shoes, which is what we're being asked of, you know, Carol is the odd surrogate.
Victoria: Yeah. Yep.
Matt: I, I feel like I'm with Carol on the idea of like, this is horrible ple you, you know, you've taken every individual out of like, this is awful. You, this is an alien invasion [00:47:00] of some kind.
Um. And, but she's made to feel like wrong for,
Victoria: yeah.
Matt: For feeling that way. How do you feel, how would you feel about it? Like, did you feel car? Like Carol is like, Carol. Why aren't you more curious about, uh, about what this
Victoria: No, no. I think I would feel more like Carol too. Yeah, me too. Yeah.
Matt: Yeah. Like
Victoria: what? It's a terrible form.
I see. Like, and maybe people say the word too much, but like, it feels to me like emotional gaslighting. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like, what do you mean this is perfect? Like. Back to the Kool-Aid reference, like why aren't you doing it with me? Right. Right. But we're all gonna have a grand old time and Carol makes that reference.
Like, just because I know a drug dealer doesn't mean I'm asking him about his heroin.
Matt: Right.
Victoria: Like. I don't need that fix. Thanks very much. You know,
Matt: but yeah, and, and like the, and to, to that end, like Kumba is so, like, he's like, there's, he's, he's, he's got such a great voice too. And he's like, he says something about how there's no, you know, there's, there's no.[00:48:00]
I don't know, crime and like mm-hmm. He's like, what? Like isn't this a good thing?
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Uh, but no, like, if you're gonna be a part of it, don't you feel like you, you're gonna lose the things you're enjoying about it. Like, if you get to fly around in Air Force One and wear cool clothes and have a harem of women, you're gonna lose all of that.
Yeah. You become part of this thing. Yeah. So why are you. A fan of it. I don't know.
Victoria: My question too is like, they've done all this, once they're done, the cleanup, right. And all those that have passed away are gone. Mm-hmm. If you are not directly involved with the immune people trying to turn them, what are you doing?
Matt: Right. Yeah.
Victoria: Like, do you still, are you like, do you have to eat anymore? Like, do you still have to live a human existence to keep the body going? Or like, is the body just gonna, it doesn't need it anymore?
Matt: What are they doing with all the bodies? Is is it, are, are they happening? Like, it's so, like, I, I hope I'm not, I hope I'm not overly interested in, in the whole good or evil part of it.
And I might be, I think, I think, I think next episode might be like, no, man, we're not,
Victoria: I think [00:49:00] kind of what they want us to do is they want us to just keep spinning on it,
Matt: maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Um, well anyway, I, I'm excited to see, uh, the next episode in, in a big way. Um, I tried to find out what that episode title is.
I don't think we know that yet. Um, but you know what we forgot to do last episode was. Promote ourselves. Not that in case you're not already sick of hearing us talk, I'd love to hear about like, where can people find more about you, uh, and what are you up to? Anything that people should know about?
Victoria: Oh, thank you.
Yeah. Well, uh, so you can find me on Instagram, VII, uh, GLIN, G-I-V-L-I-N. So v Glin. Um, or Victoria Gilland on Facebook or LinkedIn, uh, or YouTube, you know, as the, as the artists do.
Matt: Mm-hmm.
Victoria: But, uh, or you can find my production company Ascent stories on Instagram too, or ascent stories.com. So just depends. Uh, what am I doing right now?
I just. Finished, uh, production that I was a creative director on 'cause I really love community. So I had this [00:50:00] idea and that's kinda the fun thing that we're doing too, is like not wondering why we have these ideas, but just doing it and see what community we can have that jumps on board. So I did a Zodiac calendar, so I had 12 models each were the sun sign of that Zodiac and they were perfect.
Cool. For their signs. So we're wrapping up the calendar, uh, that will be for sale pretty soon. Uh, and we will have. Some proceeds going to the non-for-profit reset, which helps women that have been trafficked to restart their life with education, counseling, and housing.
Matt: Oh,
Victoria: amazing. And they don't separate them from their child.
Matt: Wow.
Victoria: So we get to keep them. The child doesn't go in the foster care system.
Matt: Wow.
Victoria: Cool. Which is amazing. That's
Matt: great.
Victoria: Um. Mike and I are always looking to help produce other films. Mm-hmm. So if people have the script, uh, we're always happy to take a look at that. Uh, he's connected in either like helping support, like putting a pitch deck and making it into something larger, which, or if you're more of an indie and you wanna hold the control, then making it more into an indie film, [00:51:00] which is good too.
Um. Yeah, we've got our Christmas party coming up, um, December 5th with panelists partnering with a local college here.
Matt: Cool.
Victoria: Uh, so that'll be fun. Meet and greet some of the networking individuals there and, uh. Yeah, I mean, I'm writing a few things too. I mean, I feel like all of us tend to do that a little bit.
You know, we wanna have our stories. Uh, I wrote and directed and produced an Acta a IP last year call before I go.
Matt: Cool.
Victoria: Uh, so now,
Matt: oh yeah, I wanna see that. Yeah.
Victoria: Yeah. So I do have it on YouTube now. You Oh. Tell
Matt: a look. Okay,
Victoria: cool. It is out. I have learned so much. It was a lot of fun. Um, I didn't put it too much in the film festival circuit 'cause now I've made a couple films after and I see where some critical errors are.
Matt: We're always, always learning,
Victoria: right? So you can take a look there. That movie is a prequel inspiration to ps I love you. So a gentleman gets a terminal illness, uh, the day that he is gonna propose to his. What he'd like to be his wife. So he decides [00:52:00] not to tell her. And how does he handle that? Um, so I'm currently writing a episodic web series.
Matt: Cool.
Victoria: Um, about, it's actually. Inspired something's happened in our lives that I'm like, this has to be written down. Like this has to be something. So, uh, I'm inspired to write two narratives. So kind of like the show. This Is Us. Have you seen that show?
Matt: Sure, yeah.
Victoria: Makes me cry like a big fat baby. So I wanna make a, I'm making, I've got the outline of the first three episodes and we're gonna make a six episode arc for the first season about, uh, we're gonna follow two narratives.
One is a gentleman in his seventies who just lost. To his wife of 53 years and like very. Uh, drama coded, like how does he find himself? How does, like a coming of age story, but in your seventies
Matt: Okay.
Victoria: Sort of thing. And, um, then we're also gonna follow, uh, sort of my story arc, which is like more rom-com.
Hallmarky style. So it'll [00:53:00] be like the bridal stylist that was never the bride and the jeweler that was never the groom and like these sorts of things. And we're gonna narrate a bit between like different generations and finding love at older ages and stuff like that. So Cool. Um. Yeah, that's working, working on that.
But always love collaborating, so, uh, if there's anything I can do to support, I love it. So. Awesome. Yeah. Thank you for having me.
Matt: Of course.
Victoria: Yeah. And what are you working on right now?
Matt: Yeah, I mean, uh, people can find me at, uh, Instagram's probably the best, the best place. Matt Waterworth. It's W-A-T-T-E-R.
W-O-R-T-H. Mm-hmm. Um, and, uh, I'm doing, I'm doing stuff. I'm, I'm getting ready to go back to teaching in January.
Victoria: That's super cool.
Matt: Um,
Victoria: the podcasting.
Matt: Yeah. Work.
Victoria: Here we are.
Matt: Studio. Yes.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: I see. If you need a podcast, uh, come, come shoot it here.
Victoria: Yeah.
Matt: Uh, and, um, yeah, I'm, I'm, I've, I've got this, I've got this, this project I'm working on, uh, called Games of Chance, which is like my attempt at like my own ip, like my [00:54:00] own.
Batman or my own
Victoria: Cool,
Matt: like a, like a, like a big story program. Who
Victoria: That's creating our own ip.
Matt: Trying, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. So, uh,
Victoria: what's happening in this chance world?
Matt: Oh, I, I don't know if I'm ready to share it. Ooh. But, but, uh, we'll, we'll, uh, we'll keep you posted.
Victoria: Okay.
Matt: So yeah, follow me on, uh, on Instagram and, uh, yeah.
Follow us on whatever social media platform.
Victoria: We'll put something together.
Matt: Yeah. Pl pod. Pl
Victoria: pod.
Matt: Um, yeah. And, uh, thanks for, thanks for joining us.
Victoria: Thanks again. Yeah. And let us know where you think it's gonna go. Is
Matt: yes,
Victoria: are they inherently good? Are they inherently bad?
Matt: Yeah.
Victoria: Is Carol gonna side, like was she running after osha?
'cause she does care a little bit and feel some humanity with osha? Or is she running after the gentleman?
Matt: Right.
Victoria: And she wants to stay and hang out and chat with him. Like what's,
Matt: yeah.
Victoria: Is she gonna go on the plane with them? Like what's,
Matt: yeah, what is, yeah.
Victoria: Where is she gonna go?
Matt: I, I mean,
Victoria: because he's going to Vegas.
Matt: Right. That's right. Right. Forgot about it. Yeah. So it's an effective show if, uh, if we're thinking about it and, and looking forward to the next
Victoria: episode and what would [00:55:00] we be doing if this was
Matt: right,
Victoria: us. Right.
Matt: That's, I mean, that's, that's just it. Right. And, uh, and so we'll see. We'll see what Carol decides.
Victoria: Mm-hmm.
Matt: Alright, thanks. Thanks Matt.
